Author Topic: The History And Future Of Livin Lite...The Untold Story  (Read 15925 times)

Dan Miller

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Re: The History And Future Of Livin Lite...The Untold Story
« Reply #15 on: February 13, 2017, 01:29:12 PM »
Hey Bronco, IN my honest opinion I would lean toward #1 or #4. Not only do they weigh less, they have the azdel cabinets (my choice over wood). #1 has an aluminum roof and an aluminum floor, another big plus for me. Although, if you're  camping in the winter,  the aluminum floor my not be your best option.
The other thing I would take into consideration is where the trailer was manufactured. I personally would stay away from any that were assembled in Topeka (Crossroads)...just don't think their hearts were in it! For what it's worth my unit was manufactured in March of 2015 and labeled a 2016 model. Based on Dan Millers timeline, I believe it was assembled at the larger facility by the same original workers under Scott Tuttle's management.
I can also attest that my trailer was assembled with TLC. I have made a lot of modifications and upgrades to my unit that required me to look beyond the outer facade....welding, wiring etc. I believe I have a well built trailer. I also believe the new team (KZ RV) are doing a great job and are continuing to build a good product. Once again, this is just my opinion and I hope it helps in your decision.

The 2014 Choice, depending on when it was built, more than likely has the older lightweight foam core counter tops and aluminum roof
The 2016 Choice would have the solid surface counter tops still with aluminum floors but with vinyl covering. Early 2016 probably still an aluminum roof
The 2017 early version not much change from the 2016 version with the exception of a Superflex roof
The Late 2017 version now feature an aluminum framed insulated laminated floor, not only adding insulation but saving quite a bit of weight. In the process of optimizing the construction we looked at areas where we could further reduce weight such as replacing the 1" aluminum tubing used in the cabinetry with 3/4" aluminum tube.

The only area wood was used in the cabinetry was the wood faces of the cabinetry 2016 and later.  The older units such as the 2014 utilized wood look azdel with the same doors but with an azdel insert in place of the aluminum used in the aluminum cabinetry.

The new wood look cabinetry, 2016 and later, feature wood doors and faces.  The balance of the cabinetry is azdel matched to the wood fronts. All cabinetry is as always aluminum framed with the only difference is we now utilize 3/4 x 3/4 aluminum tube vs 1x1 aluminum tube, reducing the overall weight.  Other changes you will see is that we are moving from Dexter Torsion axles to Dexter Spring Axles.


- Dan

djmiller - Elkhart Indiana
www.livinlite.com

Bronco2004

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Re: The History And Future Of Livin Lite...The Untold Story
« Reply #16 on: February 13, 2017, 03:49:20 PM »
Thanks everyone, your inputs clarify a lot. 

For my contribution, FWIW I just got off the phone w a dealer that a LL rep told me to contact.  He explained why the weight went up from +/- 3500# to +/- 4000# from 2015 to 2016 and then back down to +/- 3600# in latter 2017.  According to him, the weight increase was bc Thor implemented forced option packages which added weight.  But the weight drop on the latter 2017 model was the real deal, stemming from real design modifications, such as the floor, which he called "putting the 21 models on a diet."  It seems the rest of the Camplite lineups will follow suit and also be put on a diet.  This is corroborated by Dan when I emailed him and explains why the 16DBS currently weighs more than the 21's.

After everyone's input, my brain is telling me choice #4, the latter 2017, but my wife and wallet (usually interchangeable) are telling me choice #3, the early 2017--a particular non-LL dealer bought out another dealer who carried LL's and is getting rid of them.  If you and/or anyone you know are interested in a 16 DBS or TBS, they have them for a great price. 

Thanks again!
« Last Edit: February 13, 2017, 03:56:18 PM by Bronco2004 »

nanette

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Re: The History And Future Of Livin Lite...The Untold Story
« Reply #17 on: November 20, 2017, 10:40:44 PM »
Sure would love to know if the Azdel cabinets have any wood? How can I find a Camplite that has zero wood in its construction?

klaker

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Re: The History And Future Of Livin Lite...The Untold Story
« Reply #18 on: November 22, 2017, 09:20:32 AM »
nanette, buy a pre 2017 LL. My 21 was built in Dec of 2015, it is titled as a 2016 and has the aluminum roof and floor. By 2016 the aluminum cabinets were an option so not all of them will have them, IMHO the most important items are the floor and roof.

My camper has the wood cabinet doors but I don't mind, it is the white and makes the interior look real nice.

check with http://morealuminumtrailers looks like they have a new 2016 in stock,

chappy133

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Re: The History And Future Of Livin Lite...The Untold Story
« Reply #19 on: November 23, 2017, 10:52:31 AM »
Need to add .com to the hyperlink for it to work.
Chuck
2016 16' TBS
2013 F 150
Easton, PA

klaker

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Re: The History And Future Of Livin Lite...The Untold Story
« Reply #20 on: November 24, 2017, 12:46:06 PM »
I know, left it off because I didn't know if links were allowed on the forum.

ThStranger

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Re: The History And Future Of Livin Lite...The Untold Story
« Reply #21 on: January 03, 2018, 09:27:36 PM »
I have noticed that the new Camp Lite is taking a real beating on most forums. Why is that? The new models have enclosed heated underbellies and look and feel much more modern and warm. The small amount of wood that are in them now is not likely to get wet if a leak develops as I believe it is all in the drawers and trim work inside. I waited for several years till they offered the heated underbelly and ordered a 16DBS "duel axles" to be picked up in Feb. (hopefully).

klaker

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Re: The History And Future Of Livin Lite...The Untold Story
« Reply #22 on: January 04, 2018, 11:30:31 AM »
Are you sure they are heated? an enclosed underbelly prevents easy inspection, hides crappy build quality and even if heated doesn't help in the winter because there is no insulation, Enclosing an underbelly with a piece of plastic is useless.

The newer livin lites are getting dumped on by the people who remember how they were built when Scott Tuttle owned the company, we signed up for the "all aluminum construction" Thor has created a rubber roof, foam floor, and fiberglass walls facsimile. No more aluminum floors and roofs, no more 1" tubing in more places, no more aluminum walls, no more tandem torflex axles with brakes on both, instead you get led mood lighting and an enclosed underbelly.

The original livin lites were special in their construction, thor now makes them like every other camper (price is still high though, imagine that) Please forgive us purists from ragging on the new livin lites, if you own one and it works for you then that is all that matters.

« Last Edit: January 04, 2018, 11:46:12 AM by klaker »

tco2612

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Re: The History And Future Of Livin Lite...The Untold Story
« Reply #23 on: January 04, 2018, 11:39:12 AM »
DILLY DILLY

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Re: The History And Future Of Livin Lite...The Untold Story
« Reply #24 on: January 07, 2018, 09:40:15 PM »
Well klaker, if you have an all aluminum trailer then why does it concern YOU what they are building these days ?????? I have not picked mine up yet but it is on order and yes the one I seen had a heated/enclosed underbelly !! What YOU state about the underbelly is your opinion and you know what opinions are like ........I did not want the cold aluminum floor and all that cold feeling aluminum inside so I was looking at other TT's until they made the Camp Lite "warmer" feeling. The 16DBS I have on order does have duel axles ........... If YOU are happy with the older all aluminum camper then that's all that matters, why bash what YOU don't have or don't want ???????????

djsamuel

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Re: The History And Future Of Livin Lite...The Untold Story
« Reply #25 on: January 08, 2018, 09:11:47 AM »
The new dual axle Camplites use leaf springs and the MorRyde suspensions which are excellent.  The fiberglass walls are an option, but they do look nice.  My 2013 21BHS, with the aluminum roof and floor has been an outstanding trailer so far and we've taken it from Florida to places like Arizona and Utah.  That said, I would not hesitate to purchase another Camplite.  They've managed to open the line up to a larger audience while still still providing a unique trailer that is a cut above the typical offerings.  The rubber roof is a higher grade roofing material than most trailers.  The foam floor is a poor description since it is a laminate of materials with aluminum ribs, much different from foam flooring in other campers.  The 1" aluminum tubing was overkill in some areas of the camper, and this change saves a bit of weight.  So if someone buys a new Camplite they are still getting a really nice trailer; far above other many other brands.
2013 Camplite 21BHS

klaker

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Re: The History And Future Of Livin Lite...The Untold Story
« Reply #26 on: January 08, 2018, 11:47:05 AM »
Well klaker, if you have an all aluminum trailer then why does it concern YOU what they are building these days ?????? I have not picked mine up yet but it is on order and yes the one I seen had a heated/enclosed underbelly !! What YOU state about the underbelly is your opinion and you know what opinions are like ........I did not want the cold aluminum floor and all that cold feeling aluminum inside so I was looking at other TT's until they made the Camp Lite "warmer" feeling. The 16DBS I have on order does have duel axles ........... If YOU are happy with the older all aluminum camper then that's all that matters, why bash what YOU don't have or don't want ???????????


Read much?? "Please forgive us purists from ragging on the new livin lites, if you own one and it works for you then that is all that matters."  ??? ??? ??? ??? ???

The underbelly enclosing has nothing to do with opinion, they didn't insulate it, if you are so confident go camp in the winter and report back here with your experience, you can post "How do I fix frozen burst pipes" The bigger issue anyway is inspection and maintenance, have fun removing the plastic panels for inspection or work. Yep, enclosing an underbelly with a piece of plastic is useless.

I have owned 2 livin lites with aluminum floors, they were never cold, and if you camp in cold weather they make these things called rugs. Spend top dollar on a camper with a cheap foam floor so it can be a few degrees warmer, to each his own.


The leaf spring suspensions sit much higher, don't ride as smooth as the Torflex, and require maintenance. They also took away brakes on one axle. The rubber roof is same one used on half the campers out there, it is in no way a "higher grade" it is susceptible to UV damage, rips, tears, etc. There are a million posts online about plastic RV roofs and their associated problems, manufacturers use them because they are cheap.

Excuses can be made all day long but in reality the new livin lites are a case study in content reduction. If you are happy with your newer livin lite that is great, but as the OP noticed there are lots of people who prefer the better construction and materials of the older versions.


ThStranger

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Re: The History And Future Of Livin Lite...The Untold Story
« Reply #27 on: January 08, 2018, 11:56:11 AM »
Thank You djsamuel !!

ThStranger

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Re: The History And Future Of Livin Lite...The Untold Story
« Reply #28 on: January 08, 2018, 12:43:43 PM »
klaker, YOU need to get your facts straight before spewing your false information !!!!

"They also took away brakes on one axle."

I just spoke with Amy who called engineering and both axles are BRAKE AXLES !! As a matter of fact, they only order "Brake Axles" !!!!!!!!!!!!

Glad I could educate YOU on your misinformation.

klaker

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Re: The History And Future Of Livin Lite...The Untold Story
« Reply #29 on: January 20, 2018, 12:59:39 PM »
klaker, YOU need to get your facts straight before spewing your false information !!!!

"They also took away brakes on one axle."

I just spoke with Amy who called engineering and both axles are BRAKE AXLES !! As a matter of fact, they only order "Brake Axles" !!!!!!!!!!!!

Glad I could educate YOU on your misinformation.


dude chill, I saw 2 units on dealer lots with brakes on one axle only, maybe this was temporary when they switched over to leaf springs, who knows. If they are back with brakes on both axles then that is at least one good thing.

Regardless of all the back and forth and to repeat what I've said before if your camper works for you and you are happy with it that is all that matters.

Keep in mind though there are a lot of people out there who prefer the way livinlites were built originally so don't take it personally when they downplay the new versions.

Heading out to my livinlite (21BHS) in a few hours to check on it and put some camping gear in it to help de-clutter the basement, despite my comments about what thor is changing I still love my camper and will never sell it (although I did sell my first livinlite)  ;)





« Last Edit: January 25, 2018, 09:12:11 AM by klaker »